'There's no law regulating what qualifies as 1 vs 2 or 3 star [review]': Upset customer ignites feud with a leather store over negative online review

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    Font - r/facepalm Posted by u/PunCala 1 day ago Company threatens me with legal action over a bad review, has said review removed, then 3 months later threatens me again with legal action over the same review on Reddit
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    It all started when the OP posted a scathing review of a leather jacket, with photos included below.

    Font - r/r/Leathercraft Posted by u/PunCala 4 months ago PSA: When buying leather, avoid Tips & Tricks Company 2 I recently purchased several articles from Company and wanted to share my experience. Outsole and lining leathers were fine, but upper leather (TEMPESTI "MAINE LISCIO" - VEG TAN SHOULDER, colour: cognac) was unusable due to numerous imperfections The leather is listed as 1st grade, meaning there should be only a few imperfections, but I counted 31 in the picture above, and the photo o
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    Their customer service ignored the OP for two full weeks due to everyone in Italy taking a vacation each August.

    Font - When I contacted their customer service, they didn't respond for over two weeks. This was because apparently they are on summer holiday in August and don't seem to hire temps. But then they refused all responsibility and claimed that these imperfections are natural and expected. Company claim that 31 imperfections in the photo above, highlighted with circles, is "a few". When Verified Reviews wanted my review on Company I wrote a scathing 1- had it star review. Company removed immediately
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    OP noted a bunch of little imperfections, which the company they're naming and shaming says is just how leather is.

    Human body - Expectation OVERALL QUALITY OF LEATHER Excellent - 1° Grade Reality O O .com: never again

    They claim that leather just has imperfections, but OP is pointing out how many there are. 

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    Then, the company sent the OP an email after spotting the bad review. This was after the OP removed it, however.

    Product - Postato da u/PunCala 3 mesi fa 73 PSA: When buying leather, avoid Tips & Tricks info@ to me ✓ Hello We are happy to see that you followed our suggestion to not post on the social things that are your opinion and can damage the work of people and company reputation I recently purchased several articles from and wanted to share my experience. Outsole and lining leathers were fine, but upper leather (TEMPESTI "MAINE LISCIO" - VEG TAN SHOULDER, colour: cognac) was unusable due to numerous

    It reads, "We are happy to see that you followed our suggestion to not post on the social things that are your opinion and can damage the work of people and company reputation. Defaming company reputation without explaining the real situation, it's a damage for us and for all people that work with us, moreover it is a criminal offense punished internationally and we will do everything in our power to defend our rights in the appropriate forums after this post."

    There is a bit of a language barrier, but you get the gist of what they're saying — knock it off with the negative posting, because it's bad for our business. 

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    Azure - PunCala OP. 1 day ago I was polite up until today when I received the email. My response
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    However, OP did NOT hold back while replying!

    Font - to info 21:24 Ĵ It's protected by law under free speech. Go f yourself. Sincerely, ●●●

    She wants to post what she believes is a bad deal on a pricey piece of leather. 

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    So basically, the company is mad because of the bad review, and OP is even madder, because they feels it's their right to be able to leave a bad review if they don't like the products or services.

    Font - M +1 16 hr. ago Based on this, one this comment should be at the top and two, I believe OP is in the wrong and actually face-palming. Adinnieken The company clearly explains the situation despite the language barrier about the particular piece of leather they have a problem with, and they returned and refunded the money over her dissatisfaction otherwise. The problem with the review is the OP believes one thing and makes a statement of fact regarding it, the quality of the leather item sh
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    Font - The reseller has been in business 60 years, they have been conducting business this way and continue to do so, so this suggest that they have a lot more experience and knowledge than the buyer. I'm going to side with their expertise on what the buyer should expect and receive from the product they bought, not what the buyer believes she should have gotten. Nevertheless, they disagree and the seller refunds their money. At this point, the seller has offered a solution and the buyer accepte
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    Font - Has the buyer (OP) been involved in the leather trade for 60 years? Does the OP know these particular leather products? My guess is no, and instead OP is attempting to damage their reputation based on the review and the failure to clarify the situation. Again, OP, it is reasonable to say I was not satisfied with the product I received, "I attempted to contact customer service and after a delay was able to get my money refunded and the item returned." Your review and subsequent statements
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    OP claims to have experience buying and owning leather, but still thinks this leather is not good quality for what they paid for.

    Font - PunCala OP O • 15 hr. ago In this case, the seller is counting on stated experience. I also have several years of experience in leather, and I've purchased a lot. Having imperfections in the leather is completely normal, but having 31 imperfections on less than a quarter of a half hide is unacceptable. It makes the leather unusable. If the leather was graded 2nd or 3rd grade it would have been fine, but 1st grade? Never. I guess the problem in this sub is that people automatically assume
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    Others countered that this was just standard leather, and wasn't guaranteed to be special or perfect in any way.

    Font - M Adinnieken +1.6 hr. ago The seller stated that the piece only comes as standard grade. Not as a higher grade of leather. Your expectation of it being a higher grade means nothing if it cannot be purchased as anything but standard grade. If you want a higher grade of leather, like the three other pieces you purchased, buy a different style. But the piece you bought, that style, only comes as standard grade. You cannot get it In a better grade. Yes, I understand, some pieces of that style
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    Commenters began debating if OP was actually defaming the company or not. Since Reddit is an anonymous site, that seems like a really difficult case to win.

    Font - Black-Mettle +2 - 1 day ago Imagine trying to win a defamation case with a reddit post as your sole source of evidence. 589 Reply Share PunCala OP. 1 day ago They can link the post to me, but so what. Everything I said is factual and a customer review is protected by free speech. They are just bullying, or trying to. I would love to see this blow up so it would come up in Google.
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    Font - tumericschmumeric +1.6 hr. ago "Your honor I would like to submit this post from fartlord69420 into evidence as exhibit A."
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    Font - Helmidoric_of_York +1 14 hr. ago Europe has very different libel and defamation laws than the U.S. I doubt they would be enforceable against buyers overseas, but in the EU, there is plenty of precedent. Just some context: Defamation remains a criminal offence in Italy.
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    Font - WarmCookiesAndMilk 1 day ago It's a bold strategy, let's see how it plays out. 12 Reply Share Biscuits4u2 +2 20 hr. ago This is probably just the same strongarm tactic they use against everyone who gives them bad reviews. You could argue what they are doing is actually harassment. I would send them a cease-and-desist letter in reply demanding they stop contacting me.
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    Font - Dismal-Fig-731 19 hr. ago In that case a one star review seems pretty s on OPs part (like is this really the worst ever? Not company/transaction really). But there's no law regulating what qualifies as 1 vs 2 or 3 stars.
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    It's not a crime to be a bad customer, basically!

    Font - Wonderful-Radio9083 7 hr. ago This genuinely does not matter, in regards to this post. OP could be a 100% unresonable in his negative review and he still can not be sued for defemetiom. It is not a crime to be an as client.
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    One person suggested it's a culture difference that is exacerbating the situation.

    Font - UD _LeChuck 19 hr. ago . Just so you know, a large portion of Italian businesses genuinely close down over August. There's no temps covering people's holidays because EVERY employee and business in those industries takes this break.
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    Font - Legend Of BobbyTables 23 hr. ago +2. The first amendment grants you freedom of speech from the government, not private entities, so it has no bearing on a matter like this. That being said, what they are "accusing" you of would be libel, which is a civil offense. If they wanted to sue you for libel they would have to prove both that you knowingly printed false information, and you did so with the intent of harming the company or their image/brand. Proving the intent part is tough even whe
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    Font - shoulda-known-better +2. 21 hr. ago While it's true what the person said below me here..... your not an employee correct? And this isn't slander since you have evidence your all clear..... you can post about your experience with a business.... what you can't do is lie, threaten, or harass...... you could send this to the news, post on every local message board/Facebook etc....... I am also not a lawyer but I have been threatened for liable before for almost the same reasons and this is wh
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    I agree with this commenter that it doesn't make the company look good to threaten legal action over a post on the internet.

    Font - +1 - 13 hr. ago Given that we have no reason to think OP isn't telling the truth I'd say it's dodgy at best. Are there penalties for companies that do make a legal thing out of something like this if the customer is found to have been justified in the criticism? I get they're not being unlawful as such but it feels very much like a company threatening legal actions solely to intimidate and I'm sure it would work against lots of people. D move and unlikely to do the company any favours PR
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    Font - PunCala OP 13 hr. ago Thank you for your thorough review. I'm not Italian though. Again, I've said nothing untrue, and I have photos to backup my claims. The company would be foolish to try pursue this in court. I would have never even bothered to post any of this if they weren't trying to bully me by threatening with legal action. The threatening part is what really triggered me - otherwise it would have been just a bad product that I returned.
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    Font - Firm Transportation3 +3 19 hr. ago This is an international war crime and you will be found and imprisoned for life! D 3 Reply Share JoyfulExmo +1 - 17 hr. ago "Criminal offense punished internationally."
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    Font - whipfinish +1 - 22 hr. ago You are well within the fair comment standard here. Do not back down.
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    Human body - Lithaos1119 hr. ago Mmm, sounds like a tasty countersuit to me.
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    Font - Marine__0311 +1.7 hr. ago LOL, tell them to foff. Threaten to counter-sue them for harassment.
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    Human body - GeauxAllDay 6 hr. ago Pssssst.... Defamation does not apply if you are telling the truth.
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    Font - Biscuits4u2 +2. 20 hr. ago This was nothing but an idle threat. They aren't likely to win this case, because you are just giving your opinion. There is no law against giving your honest opinion about a product.
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    Agree with this person too, everyone stinks in this situation. Both the company and OP need to lighten up a little.

    Font - ww 0 Awkward_Road_710 +1 - 15 hr. ago Man. Both are in the wrong here. They gave you a product that's not up to your liking but they refunded it. Explained how the product works and gave you alternatives / suggestions. Yet you leave them a bad review. That's on you. At the same time, they wanted 'revenge' and aggressively threaten you with a legal action. Which is so petty and overkill that they can't take criticisms / feedback. You can't please everyone. That's on them. Overall it's a s


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